Road Wisdom From Next Door

Neighbor Jaime Sumner shares why the best education doesn't come from staying put - it comes from saying yes to the journey.

Some of the best advice comes from people who've lived a little differently. In this episode, Esther sits down with neighbor Jamie Sumner, whose decades of road trips, cross-country adventures, and conversations with strangers have taught him that curiosity is less about where you go and more about how you experience the world. From exploring America's backroads to discovering hidden local gems, Jaime reminds us that life gets bigger the moment we stop saying "I can't" and start saying "Let's go." 

You can learn more about Unexpected Advice by visiting https://insightfullycurious.com/unexpected-advice-podcast

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hi, advice seekers. Welcome to the second season of Unexpected Advice. I'm your host, Esther Angel. And in this season, we are going to meet some of my neighbors. I've titled The Season right next door. And my hope is you are encouraged and inspired to meet the people that you live around. We have a very interesting and eclectic world that we live in. Everyone has a story to tell, place they've been, experiences they're willing to share. So throughout this season, you'll hear from some of the people that I've gotten to know. Now, Jamie, we haven't really gotten to know each other. Yeah. I'm really excited to do this. The whole point of my podcast this season is to get to know my neighbors. Because I think that in society we often um we need more community. We have a false sense of community with social media. And I think it's really important to meet actual people. Absolutely. I also think it's really cool to meet people that might think differently than you or have different opinions of definitely different experiences because we all have different experiences. Um those are other reasons that I wanted to record this season and meet people's. So some of the folks in recording, like you, we haven't really gotten to meet or chat. We just kind of met today. And some of the neighbors I'm going to be talking to, I'm good friends with and have been since we moved here a few years ago. I moved here in 2017. Let's give you a little intro. I've moved here in 2017. When did you move into this neighborhood?

SPEAKER_00 1:33

Off uh it's been about 11 years ago. This is my aunt and uncle's house. They moved here over 30 years ago. Oh wow. And uh I moved here to take care of my uncle until he passed away. He had Parkinson's dementia and Alzheimer's all put together. Lucy tried a home, but that didn't work out.

SPEAKER_01 1:53

That's tough.

SPEAKER_00 1:54

So he came home and then I my mom called me and said Lucy needs help. And I moved here. I lived throughout the United States.

SPEAKER_01 2:04

Oh, really? Where have you lived?

SPEAKER_00 2:05

Well, I grew up in Pennsylvania here in Lancaster County. When I was 18, I packed a bag and hopped on the Amtrak train out of Lancaster and to Austin, Texas.

SPEAKER_01 2:15

Oh, okay. So I lived in Texas.

SPEAKER_00 2:17

It was culture shock, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

Yeah, I will say that Lancaster to Austin, we definitely culture shop.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

I got to meet Willie Nelson. Yeah, I was at his house. Yes. I got to travel, Lake Travis, mean everything. Just an experience of a lifetime. Years go by. I moved back to Pennsylvania. And then uh I've always been in the landscaping field, so I have that January, February off every year. So I've always hopped in my truck, grabbed my dog, and and took off. Went anyway. I drove across the country more than 20 times.

SPEAKER_01 2:54

Twenty once. You went all the drove all the way to California.

SPEAKER_00 2:57

Absolutely. I have an aunt she's passed away now, but her children live there in the Sacramento area.

unknown 3:03

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 3:04

So yeah, I I left here, went to Arkansas, my sister, Arizona, my mom, Texas, my brother, and then California, my cousins. So it was a perfect little round trip.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Is it so funny? Losing your segment. I we have done this, so I'm not from here. So when we drive out, we'll go to St. Louis. This last time we went to like, because we only made it to Montana the lot last year. It was St. Louis to Davenport, across and went to Solve Route Rushmore and everything. Went to um my cousin, I have a cousin in Montana that drove down to Denver, saw some of my aunt, my aunt and uncle there, drove to Oklahoma, saw the family.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

Oh, see, it works.

SPEAKER_01 3:42

Texas, yeah, you make that loop. Yes. Down the California once. I do have cousins and aunt and uncles, and yes, so we've gotten to go see them as well. But it's something to be said for driving across the country. It's incredible, incredible country that we live in. There's so much to see.

SPEAKER_00 3:57

Yes. When I would come home and I'd try to explain to people and show them photos of where I've been, they're like, wow, what most people around here never leave Lancaster County. I know.

SPEAKER_01 4:09

They're missing so there's so much.

SPEAKER_00 4:11

I've been to places that I felt like I was on another planet. I'm on the uh like Yosemite or uh Arizona or Red Rock or the Petrified Forest or Have you been to the uh craters, uh Craters of the Moon? Craters of the Moon.

SPEAKER_01 4:30

I was like, we are on an alien planet. Yes, it was amazing.

SPEAKER_00 4:33

Same as in Yosemite.

SPEAKER_01 4:35

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 4:36

Hiking the John Muir Trail or something like that. Yeah. And just being among these trees that are over a thousand thousand years old, thousands years old trees, you know.

SPEAKER_01 4:47

When you travel and you have those experiences and see the grandeur, even the simplicity things of the waterfalls or the lakes and the streams and rivers, and we went up through. I remember driving through the UP and uh Michigan Upper Peninsula, and that type of experience, not realizing what this is like, or going up to Minnesota. We stayed at a house with some family up in Minnesota. It's a huge house. It's like 8,000 square feet. There was four or five families there. It was six miles on a dirt road, Jamie. Right. It's like, how did they even build this house out of here? It's amazing. This is a great point of advice because the premise of the podcast is to give advice. What advice would you give for people like that are are hesitant about travel, but also like I I prefer drive to fly. Personally, me, if I can't, I want to drive it. What's your advice?

SPEAKER_00 5:34

My advice would be if you're gonna get fired from your job, if you leave for two or three weeks to go experience life, then get rid of that job because you'll find another one when you come back home.

SPEAKER_01 5:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:50

I'm saying don't say I can't, I have to be at work money. Don't say I can't, I have a mortgage to pay. I can't. You gotta be positive, take that leap of faith. Yeah, grab a bag, hop in the car, and take off. Yeah, you know, next week, look where you are. You'll be amazed.

SPEAKER_01 6:09

You know, well, and it's so I'll say this coming from a place where a lot of people can work remotely too, get in the car and go somewhere else.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

Well, I know a lot of those people, and they journey in their RVs and they work throughout the country, traveling with the weather, just like a nomad. Yeah, go for it. And they love it, the lifestyle.

SPEAKER_01 6:29

Yes, that lifestyle is really easy. And even if you don't have time, you know something that's always struck me is Pennsylvania is gorgeous. Where we live, we have access to the Little Grand Canyon, you have access to trails and rail trails, and you have access to so much right where you are. Correct. If you live wherever you live, no matter what country or state you live in, explore, explore, have that explorer spirit. I didn't really see that in you.

SPEAKER_00 6:51

Oh yeah, I was in Europe and I have friends there, and uh the one was talking to me says, you know, not very many people in the United States have to travel to other countries because the United States has so many unique, individually uh states where there are so many states that are just different, completely different. You don't have to go to another country to experience something different. It's all right here in the United States. Yeah. So I thought that was strange coming from them.

SPEAKER_01 7:20

Yeah, because well, and a lot of people don't in Europe don't realize how big the United States is.

SPEAKER_00 7:25

True.

SPEAKER_01 7:25

Like it's literally, I think somebody didn't overlay and speaking about the conflict in Ukraine. It was like that's like the distance from I don't know, like New York to Arizona or something. I mean, you just don't have the comprehension of how close things are in Europe, and people in Europe don't understand. I was in Texas, dude. You can drive 14 hours in Texas and never leave Texas, right? You're still driving straight across. It's just so huge. It's a it's a very it's magnificent.

SPEAKER_00 7:50

When I moved to Colorado, that was an experience. My brother called me. It was winter time. He said, uh, do you want to move to Colorado? And I said, sure. That's my answer right away. Sure. He said he said, I'll be there in a week with a truck and tractor trailer, and we loaded everything up in this, put my truck in the in the trailer, and we drove out to Colorado.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

And where's you live in Colorado?

SPEAKER_00 8:14

Montrose, Colorado. That's uh near Grand Junction, and uh tell your ride would be about a half an hour away, is uh where I had a lot of experiences. I lived in Montrose and uh I helped my brother with his he bought an apartment complex and bought a bunch of apartments. He wanted me to come out and help him manage it and help rehab them. And we had a great time that when I was all done, I needed something to do, so I was looking for a job. And this woman up in Ridgway, she was growing in discipline herbs to make medicines, and so I went there and I applied, and she's like, Yeah, I make all this medicine, but I can't grow the plants. And I said, Well, I can grow all the plants. Yeah, and we can make them so we had this great journey of growing plants in Ridgway, Colorado, and it's called Shining Mountain Herbs.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

Okay. Are you still in touch with them? Are they still in business?

SPEAKER_00 9:08

Yes, they are still in business, although she sold it because she uh sold it to a younger couple who had all the experience of growing and making the tinctures.

SPEAKER_01 9:18

Okay, very cool. So you do a lot of growing. The yard here is flipping amazing, I will say. What what kind of got you into growing? Is that something always been? Is that because of you? I mean, because you also will I'd love to touch on this too, because you grew up in an Amish community. Yes. Were you Amish?

SPEAKER_00 9:35

No.

SPEAKER_01 9:36

Okay, but you grew up.

SPEAKER_00 9:37

My parents were not Amish.

SPEAKER_01 9:39

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 9:39

So some people think if you're Amish, you have to be Amish, but you don't. When you become an age, you have a choice. Of course, your mom and dad and grandparents hope you become Amish or want to be Amish, but it's your choice. You don't ever have to be Amish. So my mother and my father, my father's parents were Mennonite, my mom's parents were German and Jews, so that's a combination of a whole bunch going on. But my mother and my father did not choose to be Mennonite or Amish in any kind of way. They moved to California and they had a bunch of issues. But gratefully, I was raised by my grandparents in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. And my grandfather was uh an inventor. He invented pantyhose, he invented the machines. Yeah, he was into textile. You know, they make all their own clothes, they make all their own linens. He designed the machines and the stitching and everything to make panties, take underwear and socks and create one piece pantyhose. Isn't that bizarre? Yeah. Anyway, uh, so he also was a horticulturist. He taught me all about all the plants. He grew all the plants there at the house, and I lived with him and learned about every plant and planted all the plants, and we made medicines out of them. We ate everything we grew. Yes. So that's where my knowledge started. And then he had some jobs out, like landscaping jobs, and he'd take me along with them once in a while. And I loved it. And then I asked him one day, and I said, Seriously, these people pay us to do this?

SPEAKER_01 11:17

I love it. This is what I'm doing. You've continued on, but stay in touch with the community. Have you stayed in touch with that community?

SPEAKER_00 11:24

Yeah, I still do today.

SPEAKER_01 11:25

Yeah, that's I mean, anybody can.

SPEAKER_00 11:28

There's a misconception of Amish, they're just like us, they're just normal people. Yes, they like their community and their gatherings, and they don't take on things in our society that we do. Yeah. You know, they're very conservative. They're uh very respectful to their family and their traditions.

SPEAKER_01 11:49

Well, they're also very respectful. I find what's what is really interesting to me is that Lincaster County is one of the top places for refugees. And I find that I think because of the Mennonite and the Amish influence of Live and Let Live, like they're very respectful of other folks' beliefs to the point of learning, understanding. It isn't exclusive as much as it is their choices, but they know that that's a choice and they respect the choices of others. It's a really fascinating mixture that you wouldn't people from the outside don't live here, wouldn't expect.

SPEAKER_00 12:20

Correct. People who don't live around the Amish don't understand them. They have a different concept. I also worked at an AMACO station back in the days when you a car pulled in, you pumped their gas and watched your windshield and checked the air and their tires for them. I did all that, and a lot of people would come in from New York and they would be like, Oh, where's the reservations of the Amish? I'm like, there's no reservations. Oh, yeah, that's how they advertise it in New York. Oh, I'm like, sorry, ma'am. No, it's not like that. They're normal people, they live on their farms, so everybody's confused about them.

SPEAKER_01 12:54

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:55

And that that's fine. You don't need to know about them. Yeah, without you. Yeah, it's just fine.

SPEAKER_01 13:01

So you traveled all over the country, you grew up here, and you turned 18. Decided to, you know, get on the Amtrak and and and travel around. What brought you brought you back to settling here? Was it when you're starting taking care of family or was it before that?

SPEAKER_00 13:14

Well, what happened was uh my brother was in the Navy, he was in active duty when I became came of age. I was not able to join because I'm the only male in my family, other than my brother, and he was in active duty in the Cuban mission mission missile crisis, so they wouldn't take me no matter what. I was bummed out about that. Yeah. And uh I just always had that journey to go, to go. He got out of the Navy and he went to Texas, so I went to him. Okay. That's what started that to Texas for my first time. I lived there for a couple years and I was in a relationship and we moved back here, and then that fell apart. So that's how I moved back here. Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_01 13:59

Okay, so you settle back down here, but you you still travel, like you said.

SPEAKER_00 14:03

Every year where you are. Yes, every year. So leave here and go to Arkansas, spend a week or two there. Go to Texas, spend a week or two there. Yep. Go to Arizona, spend a week, go to California, spend a week. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:17

Where do you do you always look forward to going back to? Do you go to new places or do you tend to like, I want to go back to visit the thing and do something new? What do you what do you kind of do?

SPEAKER_00 14:25

Well, you know, I am the my mother was the youngest in her family, and I'm the youngest in my family. My brother and sister are 10 years older than me. So pretty much everyone has passed away now. And I really don't have that desire to journey across the country anymore because my mother's gone, my aunts are gone. Yeah. So for the last two years, I went to Florida. I just drove straight down to Florida.

SPEAKER_01 14:51

Yes, I know. It's so hot. It's so hot in the summer.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

So I went to Fort Lauderdale and uh just had the greatest time. It's funny. People are walking around with winter coats on everything. I'm crazy. What's interesting? I'm at the beach every day by myself. Not really, but there were some people there, yes. Actually, this year. Uh, this was my first winter staying home because now uh I'm taking care of Lucy and I want to be here, and I kind of lost that desire to hop in the truck and take off. Yeah, sure. Maybe it's also it is exhausting as you get older.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

You have to take more stops.

SPEAKER_00 15:33

Yes, stop every night instead of drive two nights.

SPEAKER_01 15:36

Oh my gosh. I my husband and I, I remember when we first got married, we did one of those truck across the road from Texas to Minnesota. Right. So and we at the end of it, we're like, we are almost too old for this.

SPEAKER_00 15:47

Yes, I know it forget it.

SPEAKER_01 15:49

No, I will not do it.

SPEAKER_00 15:51

That's what happens. I used to drive from here to my sister's straight through from here to Arkansas. Oh, yeah. Now I'm like, no, I'm gonna stop. I'll drive six, seven hours. I'm gonna stop and get a room. Yeah, for the night. I'll see you tomorrow.

SPEAKER_01 16:04

See you later. Totally do that. Well, not the school go is 12 hours. Like if I can, if it's 12 hours straight, and we'll it'll take us like 13, 14, but 12 hours is my max in one day, and then we'll stop. Right. Some people are like, oh my god, that's so long. We can do that in one day because then you're there and you're there for the next morning. You get a good night's sleep, you're there for the next morning. But if you have to go much further than that, 14, 15 hours, that's kind of where I draw the line. I'll get there in the morning for lunch.

SPEAKER_00 16:31

That's the way to do it.

SPEAKER_01 16:32

We're gonna go. Actually, we're going to look like when next time we go to Oklahoma, and it's not even the drive there because we'll stop and see family, it's the drive back. That was always the hardest. Yeah, you just thought, oh, you just want to be home.

SPEAKER_00 16:43

I just want to get home now. Yes. Well, one time I was driving, I tried to drive straight here from California, and I had a van back then. And uh, I was driving and driving on the highways for so long, I was so tired. I just wanted to get off the highway. The Route 30 is a very old highway, it's just a two-lane back road. Now I got on that and I was just as happy as can be. I drove that for a day until I got home here in Lancaster. So that the highway can wear on the highway.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

The interstates, I don't know, interstates are my least favorite. I don't want them. No, I will say having these newer cars though that help you like keep in lane. Yeah, I feel a little safer driving.

SPEAKER_00 17:24

You could fall asleep behind the wheel.

SPEAKER_01 17:27

Don't listeners, I don't, but um, yeah, I feel safer knowing that if I do happen to like, like, okay, now I know how to stop. Last time I had a drive back from um Davenport, it was just me and the two kids, and I'm the only driver. My husband couldn't be there. And I told the kids, you gotta, we're gonna, you know, you gotta help keep talk to me, make sure I'm engaged. About every 30 minutes, my daughter from the back seat was slap me on the arm. We're not dying today. Okay, okay, all right. So my kids are really good about they're great. We did so much road tripping when uh when they were just that they love travel. And I think that's if I had advice to give to people about travel and exploration is take your kids young. People like, oh, I want to wait till they're older. Well, then they don't know how the experience will work. If you get them used to it conditions, and when you're younger, it makes it way easier when they're three, four, or five, taking them on a plane, taking them in the car for a long drive. That's I advocate for kids. Yeah, do it. My mom would always say, Esther, you can do all the things you did before having kids. It just takes a little longer. That's right. Take them. Absolutely do it. Have the adventure. I love what you said at the beginning of this. Don't use the excuse, just you know.

SPEAKER_00 18:37

Right. So you're reminding me something. I was very fortunate as a child because we would get on an airplane and I don't remember where we went. I think it was Florida. I'm talking about maybe I was probably five, six, seven years old. So I think uh what my grandfather always said was, get out and travel. It's the best education you'll ever get. Yeah. And I think that's true because I learned so much from the local people when I'm in an area. I don't become I don't drag Lancaster there. Yeah, immerse myself in what's going on there and learn and listen to everybody else.

SPEAKER_01 19:20

100%. Well, and especially I think for my kids, I want my kids to have that similar experience because I want them to know the world doesn't revolve around you, first of all, and the world doesn't exist just the way you experience it. Correct. The world exists in so many other ways for so many other people and cultures. We've traveled internationally uh and domestically, and I think that it's so important for uh young people as much as we can give them the exposure and the opportunity to learn.

SPEAKER_00 19:48

You can uh tell when I meet somebody new, I can usually tell if they're well traveled or not because they you can sense it from them that they have knowledge that not many other people have. So it's so important to travel.

SPEAKER_01 20:03

It is, it is, and it have those experiences. And I like the other piece of advice, and I hear you saying it, it's so true. Don't take where you are with you as much as you immerse yourself in there. Take go there and have that experience.

SPEAKER_00 20:15

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 20:16

Dive bar. Like, and I always will ask if I'm staying at a hotel. Sometimes I'll ask the people at the front, where would you get lunch today? Not where do you send the tourists, right? Where would you go get lunch today? And I did that in New Orleans, and they were like, Well, there's a shop around the corner, and this shop was packed to the gills of crap, and it's like a convenience store with the most delicious deli sandwich I had on the because that's what they would eat.

SPEAKER_00 20:38

I'm not kidding you. I did that in San Francisco. My cousin had taken me, she lived in Sacramento, and uh we went to San Francisco and we were just having a good day walking around the city and being tourists, and and I was we were at this uh pub and it was known for its Irish coffees, so yes, they were wonderful, delicious. And I asked about our tender and I said, So when you go out for lunch, where do you go for lunch? And that's exactly what I said. Yeah, I said, not the normal place, where do you go? And he's like, Really? I'm like, Yeah, and he said, Well, there's this Chinese family down off the alley. Yeah, and uh, it doesn't look like much, just go check that out. And when we did, it was amazing.

SPEAKER_01 21:22

It's amazing, isn't it? Yeah, it's so good. Sometimes they'll I'll be like, hey, what's your name? So when I'll go in, I'll be like, hey, you know, Larry said Larry from the you know hotel over here, the Hilton told me that this was a great place to change. I'm like, okay, you know Larry. All right, give you good advice and and guide you, uh guide you along. Yeah, I think that's a great that's another piece is talk to the people that you meet, talk to the people that meet. My dad did that all the time.

SPEAKER_00 21:47

I have that in me, even when my neighbor here he lives in New York, and uh I go up and visit with him once in a while, and we'll be walking the streets, you know, just going out walking and going. And I just can't help myself, and I've apologized if for before I have to say hi to everybody as I'm walking by on, and I just do.

SPEAKER_01 22:07

Ah, but it's it's it's my dad's. Yeah, and my dad was like that a lot, and then it was funny. We went to Oklahoma and we're walking down the street in the in the south. Everybody says hi. And we were I was passing someone, and I I said, Oh, hi, how are you? Oh, I'm doing well. Hi, and my kids are like, Mom, do you know that person? I'm like, no, I don't know. They're just walking through the store. I mean that's how you just interact. Growing up there, I was very much like, oh yeah, just talk to everybody, won't hurt anything. Well, usually the worst they're gonna do is just ignore you or look at you, all right. I don't have to do, I'll move on.

SPEAKER_00 22:39

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 22:40

You have given some fantastic advice on um taking taking in life and experiencing, we only have what this one life to leave.

SPEAKER_00 22:47

Take that leap of faith, yes. I know we're all we're all conditioned to stay home, be at work eight to five or nine to five, or constantly go to work Monday through Friday. And oh yeah, you might get a vacation for a week or two throughout your life, but there's so much more to life. And people say, Well, I can't do that. Well, that's because you didn't try yet. You can do it. Sure, it might change your norm for a little bit, but you'll be better off for it. Yes. So I've moved so many times, but I've never gone unemployed for more than a week, getting somewhere and just getting out of experience. Oh, what do you do? Oh, I'm a horiculturist landscape. Can I do anything for you? Well, yeah. There you go. That's it. It's not gonna happen until you get out there and try.

SPEAKER_01 23:38

Yes, it try and meet people and be willing, open. I think being we've we're so cautious so many times. And again, I think social media makes us we see the the negative and we assume the world is like that, and it's such a small percentage. Most people are just like us, most people uh just want to have a nice conversation, they want to live life in a positive way, they want to they want to have a good thing going, and they're happy to have a conversation with you about it.

SPEAKER_00 24:00

Right.

SPEAKER_01 24:01

I love it. Well, thank you, Jamie. Thank you so much for taking time with me. Yeah, chatting with me. I had fun. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:08

I want to do another podcast someday. I have all kinds of things to say.